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Deathly Hallows-MAY CONTAIN SPOILERS


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#21 amazinz5

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Posted 24 July 2007 - 09:11 PM

Not really. J.K. Rowling used her imagination to create an entire world, completely different from reality, and yet made it real by creating such full characters. Granted, the star of the series was Harry Potter, but it was the strength of the supporting characters, the ancillary ones, and the antagonist especially which made this one of the most beloved works of literature since Tolkein's The Lord of the Rings trilogy.

the way she sets things up and connects them all in the end is mind blowing. thats the biggest thing i like about her...like with hermione supporting elve's rights, and then them helping take on the death eaters in the end, or mentioning aberforth and then having him play an important role in getting them into hogwarts...i love everything she does. its like she knew exactly where she was going with the story from the very beginning. im really disappointed that this is it for harry potter.

#22 Bruce Wayne

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Posted 25 July 2007 - 08:56 AM

the way she sets things up and connects them all in the end is mind blowing. thats the biggest thing i like about her...like with hermione supporting elve's rights, and then them helping take on the death eaters in the end, or mentioning aberforth and then having him play an important role in getting them into hogwarts...i love everything she does. its like she knew exactly where she was going with the story from the very beginning. im really disappointed that this is it for harry potter.

Correct, my astute friend!

Everything was connected!!!

She had inserted innocuous, off the cuff lines in the earlier books, the mentioning of an old wizard or witch by one of Harry's friends or teachers that had major implications later on in the series. This level of continuity proves her adeptness in the written word, one that places her in the upper echelon of some of the greatest writers in the history of literature.
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#23 BelieveinNYM

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 06:23 PM

I finally finished it, and I thought it was awesome!!! The ending/epilogue was not what I expected, but I thought it was really nice, like Bruce said. Harry became a normal wizard and all his friends stuck with him. Overall, it ended very happily, and I was expecting something sadder. I was so relieved when all 3 of the main characters wound up surviving, because I thought one of them would go any moment.
For me, the best chapters were "The Battle At Hogwarts" and "The Prince's Tale." I thought the whole truth behind Snape and his agenda was great, even though I suspected some of it already (i.e., Dumbledore's planned death). I'll also say that I started tearing up when Harry saw the appearances of his parents in "The Forest Again." That was when I thought it was really over. All in all, great ending to one of the best series I've ever read. :)
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#24 amazinz5

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 08:10 PM

I finally finished it, and I thought it was awesome!!! The ending/epilogue was not what I expected, but I thought it was really nice, like Bruce said. Harry became a normal wizard and all his friends stuck with him. Overall, it ended very happily, and I was expecting something sadder. I was so relieved when all 3 of the main characters wound up surviving, because I thought one of them would go any moment.
For me, the best chapters were "The Battle At Hogwarts" and "The Prince's Tale." I thought the whole truth behind Snape and his agenda was great, even though I suspected some of it already (i.e., Dumbledore's planned death). I'll also say that I started tearing up when Harry saw the appearances of his parents in "The Forest Again." That was when I thought it was really over. All in all, great ending to one of the best series I've ever read. :)

great ending to the only series i've ever read besides magic tree house

#25 goldglv17

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Posted 26 July 2007 - 11:37 PM

I finally finished it, and I thought it was awesome!!! The ending/epilogue was not what I expected, but I thought it was really nice, like Bruce said. Harry became a normal wizard and all his friends stuck with him. Overall, it ended very happily, and I was expecting something sadder. I was so relieved when all 3 of the main characters wound up surviving, because I thought one of them would go any moment.
For me, the best chapters were "The Battle At Hogwarts" and "The Prince's Tale." I thought the whole truth behind Snape and his agenda was great, even though I suspected some of it already (i.e., Dumbledore's planned death). I'll also say that I started tearing up when Harry saw the appearances of his parents in "The Forest Again." That was when I thought it was really over. All in all, great ending to one of the best series I've ever read. :)



Personally I expected to be bawling by the end of this book, but I did not at all. However I thought the Sacking Of Severus Snape followed by The Battle of Hogwarts were amazing. The moments that got me were:

Dobby Death (Killed me when it was described as Harry folding his tiny limbs over in the grave)
Percy shows up (Goosebump moment) followed by "Hey Minister, in case you didn't know I quit"
James tells Harry to follow him through the woods and will stay with him the whole time.
:(



I still have no idea what's going on....


#26 metzol

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 12:13 PM

Finished last night and was thoroughly satsified. It is remarkable in the sense that Rowling had millions of fans' expectations to meet. Expectations that built over seven books and ten years. And she not only met those expectations but exceeded them. How do you finish a story that has all of these rabid people hanging on to every detail and every word? Compare it to how The Sopranos ended and you'll get a sense of her achievement.
She really hit it out of the ball park with this book.
The Battle of Hogwarts was stirring. Yes, stirring. I've never written that word before. Now I have. This will make for a great movie.

Having said that...
In my opinion, the book would've been much better if Harry had died at the end. It seemed like that was about to happen and as I read the chapter where he approaches Voldemort for his death, I thought,"Yes, let him die. It would make the book that much more powerful." I'm not against happy endings but I wish this book didn't end like it did.

Or at least kill Ron or Hermione. :)

I also grew weary of the trio's constant bickering. Enough already, grow up!

I had some problems with the plot. I didn't like how they escaped so easily from the Malfoy basement. How come they were left to their own devices and nobody was watching them, especially Potter?

I also didn't like how Voldemort doesn't really make sure Potter is dead at the end. He had Draco's mom check his pulse? That's it? He should 've been decapitated, drwan and quartered, and then set on fire because of what was at stake for Voldemort.

Nitpicking aside, I still loved the book and entire series and will re-read all of them when my daughters get a little older.
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#27 metzol

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 12:16 PM

the way she sets things up and connects them all in the end is mind blowing. thats the biggest thing i like about her...like with hermione supporting elve's rights, and then them helping take on the death eaters in the end, or mentioning aberforth and then having him play an important role in getting them into hogwarts...i love everything she does. its like she knew exactly where she was going with the story from the very beginning. im really disappointed that this is it for harry potter.



Correct, my astute friend!

Everything was connected!!!

She had inserted innocuous, off the cuff lines in the earlier books, the mentioning of an old wizard or witch by one of Harry's friends or teachers that had major implications later on in the series. This level of continuity proves her adeptness in the written word, one that places her in the upper echelon of some of the greatest writers in the history of literature.


I wonder if she really set things up that early on. I suspect that as she was outlining this last book she went back and picked and chose obscure details and forgotten characters to be brought back. Either way, I agree, it was highly effective. I love how many of the past characters made cameo appearnces, from the spiders to the centaurs.
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#28 birtelcom

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 12:19 PM

Great book.

I loved the epilogue---
Harry finally got what he always wanted, a loving family and a normal life.

I agree completely. And I was particularly moved by the moment when Harry assures his child that it would be entirely OK if he is sorted for Slytherin (including the disclosure of Albus Potter's middle name). That tolerance is one very important thread and I was glad to see it summed up this way.

I also would not be disappointed if we someday have a book on the adventures of young Lily, James and Albus if they are as fresh and humane and moving and gracefully written as the 7 Harry books have been. Although clearly the arc of Harry Potter's story is complete and must be left as such, the possibilities of the world Rowling created seem to me not yet necessarily exhausted.

#29 metzol

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 12:20 PM

all for it. i cant say how much i loved this book. rowling is a genius, the biggest of my lifetime. i think every single aspect of the series was perfect, except they never said what happened to the hallows. dont you think harry would destroy them, seeing what they did to dumbledore? the part where neville killed the snake was probably my favorite. either that or the part where kreacher led the attack on the death eaters. im in shock...i cant believe how good it was. the best i can describe my reaction is :vomit-smiley-007: .



Perhaps a spot hyperbolic?



Not really. J.K. Rowling used her imagination to create an entire world, completely different from reality, and yet made it real by creating such full characters. Granted, the star of the series was Harry Potter, but it was the strength of the supporting characters, the ancillary ones, and the antagonist especially which made this one of the most beloved works of literature since Tolkein's The Lord of the Rings trilogy.


I'm with Luke on this one. I got swept up in the hype and became a fan of the series, but I wouldn't put Rowling up there with Truman Capote and George Orwell just yet.

She's more on par with Stephen King. She knows how to tell a great story. Nothing more, nothing less. Sometimes (most of the time) that's all that's required.
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#30 metzol

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 12:25 PM

The epilogue took place 19 years after the final battle. So Potter, Ron, and Hermione would each be 36 years old and they each had kids already attending Hogwarts meaning their kids would be at least 12. So after the death of Voldemort they must've gotten married and had kids within 7 years, by the ages of 24. Shouldn't they have taken a breather and maybe travelled the world first? :mysterymachine:
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#31 birtelcom

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 12:40 PM

The epilogue took place 19 years after the final battle. So Potter, Ron, and Hermione would each be 36 years old and they each had kids already attending Hogwarts meaning their kids would be at least 12. So after the death of Voldemort they must've gotten married and had kids within 7 years, by the ages of 24. Shouldn't they have taken a breather and maybe travelled the world first? :mysterymachine:

The importance of family is so essential to the sensibility of the books that a gaggle of kids is about the happiest and most satisfying ending I could imagine for these characters. So many of the characters seem fundamentally damaged or incomplete by their lack of family: Voldemort and Snape and Dumbledore and Sirius, and until the end Harry himself. Throughout the seven books, the Burrow with its big, loving family of Weasleys is presented as the warm and desirable antithesis of all the lack felt by those characters who suffer outside of such a family. To have Harry and Hermione both becoming part of the Weasley clan and expanding it to another generation seems the ultimate reward.

And after all the brushes with death, that our heroes went home and promptly reproduced like rabbits seems psychologically persuasive and wholly in character.

#32 metzol

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 12:51 PM

The importance of family is so essential to the sensibility of the books that a gaggle of kids is about the happiest and most satisfying ending I could imagine for these characters. So many of the characters seem fundamentally damaged or incomplete by their lack of family: Voldemort and Snape and Dumbledore and Sirius, and until the end Harry himself. Throughout the seven books, the Burrow with its big, loving family of Weasleys is presented as the warm and desirable antithesis of all the lack felt by those characters who suffer outside of such a family. To have Harry and Hermione both becoming part of the Weasley clan and expanding it to another generation seems the ultimate reward.

And after all the brushes with death, that our heroes went home and promptly reproduced like rabbits seems psychologically persuasive and wholly in character.

Nicely stated. The family theme is very important to the books and the epilogue does tie it up nicely, just too nicely for my taste. But there are other themes such as bravery versus cowardice and sacrificing one's self for others. And with the way the book ends Rowling resolves those themes effectively as Potter's bravery defeats Voldemort's and Potter's self sacrifice saves the wizarding world. Maybe I'm just a fatalist, but I just feel that Harry dying would've taken the series up to a higher level and would've been much more powerful.
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#33 BelieveinNYM

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 01:45 PM

Nicely stated. The family theme is very important to the books and the epilogue does tie it up nicely, just too nicely for my taste. But there are other themes such as bravery versus cowardice and sacrificing one's self for others. And with the way the book ends Rowling resolves those themes effectively as Potter's bravery defeats Voldemort's and Potter's self sacrifice saves the wizarding world. Maybe I'm just a fatalist, but I just feel that Harry dying would've taken the series up to a higher level and would've been much more powerful.


I definitely do see what you're saying. But I had read an article before the book's release, and it did make some valid points about Harry's fate. This person was talking about how Harry would most likely live because they're still investing so much money in the last two movies that are due out, plus the theme park that's opening in 2009. It would seem rather odd to invest millions in a series that's so close-ended with Harry's death. Also, two words: Sherlock Holmes. That's why I had a feeling that he would live. I am a little surprised that Ron and Hermione also lived though. I thought that at least one of them would go, though I was right when one of the Weasleys was killed off anyway.
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#34 metzol

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 02:44 PM

I definitely do see what you're saying. But I had read an article before the book's release, and it did make some valid points about Harry's fate. This person was talking about how Harry would most likely live because they're still investing so much money in the last two movies that are due out, plus the theme park that's opening in 2009. It would seem rather odd to invest millions in a series that's so close-ended with Harry's death. Also, two words: Sherlock Holmes. That's why I had a feeling that he would live. I am a little surprised that Ron and Hermione also lived though. I thought that at least one of them would go, though I was right when one of the Weasleys was killed off anyway.

Ahh well, money changes everything. Compromising a story for the sake of a theme park is the difference between a work of art and just popular entertainment. If what you say is true then I can never consider Rowling a literary genius.
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#35 BelieveinNYM

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 03:45 PM

Ahh well, money changes everything. Compromising a story for the sake of a theme park is the difference between a work of art and just popular entertainment. If what you say is true then I can never consider Rowling a literary genius.


Oh I highly doubt she compromised it for the sake of a theme park, especially since she wrote the ending many years ago and the theme park idea was announced to the public only recently. The article I read was only an opinion piece written by a reader anyway, so it may or may not be entirely true. I do agree with the Sherlock Holmes bit that was brought up though.
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#36 metzol

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 03:55 PM

Check out this pretty funny reading diary of New York book critic Sam Anderson's experience with the book. He brings up a good point about how absurd it is that Ron so easily learns Parseltongue.
http://nymag.com/dai...ly_hallows.html
New York’ Book Critic Sam Anderson's ‘Deathly Hallows’ Reading Diary

Courtesy of Scholastic
Once it became clear that no amount of credentials, real or fabricated, was going to get me an advance copy of Harry Potter and the Noun That Makes No Sense Until Chapter 21 — and after Michiko Kakutani went all Slytherin on us — I decided to take the opposite tack and surrender fully to the magic. At midnight, I stood at the very back of the gigantic horde at my local bookstore (so far in the back that the employees all applauded when I bought my copy) and left at 2 a.m., brandishing the book triumphantly over my head — not an easy lift, since it's exactly as long as Gravity's Rainbow and The Brothers Karamazov. It took me two full days of hard reading. In loving memory of my lost weekend (and in lieu of a full review, which will appear in the next print issue), I've produced the following hour-by-hour catalogue of my weekend of wizardry.

Warning: There are more spoilers here than there are goblins at Gringott's, or house-elves in the Hogwarts basement, or adverbs in a J.K. Rowling sentence (he wrote, snarkily).

Saturday, 2:15 a.m. Page 1. The novel is dedicated, like Time magazine's Person of the Year Issue, to All of Humanity ("You, if you have stuck with Harry until the very end"). I find this cheesy but also mildly touching — which is perfectly appropriate, since that's been the emotional keynote of the entire series. The scary highbrow epigraphs (one from Aeschylus), as well as my gut, are telling me that Harry is going to die. After glancing through the table of contents, I'm working very hard to resist skipping ahead to Chapter 20 ("Xenophilius Lovegood"). The book opens with a generic evil-warlord crony meeting that's reminding me a lot of He-Man, right down to the fish-in-a-barrel sexual innuendo:

He drew out his own wand and compared the lengths.
"Enough," said Voldemort, stroking the angry snake.

"And you, Draco?" asked Voldemort, stroking the snake's snout with his wand-free hand.


That's all from Chapter 1! And I'm not even counting the name "Pius Thicknesse." I go to bed at 3 a.m., on page 35.

Saturday, 11 a.m. Page 79. All of Harry's friends appear in the backyard like a magical A-Team. They concoct a Saddam-style decoy plan to hide him, then fly straight into an ambush. Casualties of the battle include Harry's tooth, George Weasley's ear, Mad-Eye Moody, Hedwig the owl (who seems oddly undermourned), and whatever hope I have left that I'm going to enjoy my weekend. Rowling is a genius at imaginative world-building, but she's mediocre at these oversize plots and climactic epic-battle royales. Watching Harry buy school supplies is 100 times more original and thrilling than watching him battle Voldemort over the fate of the universe.

Saturday, 12:45 p.m. Page 231. Harry and the gang are so deep in Mission Impossible–style reconnaissance (the plan is to break into the Ministry of Magic) that I take a nap.

Saturday, 3:35 p.m. Page 286. The plot has been washed away on a hormonal tsunami of teen angst. Things are getting Blair Witch–ish: endless bickering on a never-ending camping trip. Hermione tells Ron to kindly insert his wand into his anus. They keep saying "effing" and "hell." Some entertaining idiomatic wizard cursing: "Merlin's pants!" and "what in the name of Merlin's most baggy Y Fronts" and "why in the name of Merlin's saggy left—" (I'm thinking "wizard-teat").

Saturday, 6:02 p.m. Page 434. I smell terrible and am eating peanut butter directly out of the jar and fighting off another nap. Reading this novel apparently creates the same symptoms as major depression and agoraphobia.

Saturday, 6:50 p.m. Page 460. I'm getting woozy from the overplotting. Rowling has cranked the "coincidence" dial up to eleven and is now flagrantly abusing her "imminent-death-thwarted-at-the-last-possible-moment" privileges. Harry has just been saved from certain doom, 007-style, by his captors' greedy bickering. Then he's thrown in a dungeon that also happens to contain most of his long-lost friends. As a reader, my interest in the plot has been reduced to two main questions: (1) Does Snape turn out to be good? and (2) Does Harry live or die? I officially don't care about the links that get us there. Roughly five hours of reading to go before I can be reunited with my family.

Sunday, 2:06 p.m. Page 475. Suddenly I care again. Dobby dies in a genuinely moving scene: "And then with a little shudder the elf became quite still, and his eyes were nothing more than great glassy orbs, sprinkled with light from the stars they could not see." Harry buries the house-elf, which seems to jolt him out of his post-adolescent funk and into manhood. I'm suddenly optimistic about the last 300 pages.

Sunday, 3:15 p.m. Page 586. Harry emerges, finally, into the halls of Hogwarts. For me, a reliable index of how good a Harry Potter book will be is how long it takes him to get to Hogwarts — the sooner, the better. Here it's almost 600 pages.

Sunday, 3:40 p.m. Page 610. Voldemort delivers a menacing speech using high-school valedictorian rhetoric: "Give me Harry Potter, and none shall be harmed. Give me Harry Potter, and I shall leave the school untouched. Give me Harry Potter, and you will be rewarded."

Sunday, 4:22 p.m. Page 625. Two inexcusable things happen very quickly. First, Ron skips back with an armful of basilisk fangs from the Chamber of Secrets, which he says he got into by faking Parseltongue. You know, Parseltongue: the horrifying snake-language hitherto spoken exclusively by Harry and Voldemort and serpents — a talent so rare that Harry was ostracized when people found out about it. Ron says he just imitated the noises he heard Harry make. Now, excuse my righteous Potter-dork anger here, but this is absurd — if this were possible, dark wizards and mischievous Hogwarts students would have been faking it for centuries, raising all kinds of snake-related hell. It's a totally B.S. plot shortcut that needs to go on Rowling's permanent record.

Also, at a crucially tense moment, when there's absolutely no time to lose, Ron and Hermione decide to make out over the cause of house-elf liberation. This book is getting silly. My scar is throbbing.

Sunday, 4:58 p.m. Page 649. Remember in Lord of the Rings, where good and evil hordes are battling over the castle, and it looks like the good guys are losing, but then all of a sudden they're winning, but then they're losing, but then they're winning again? Well, this is exactly like that, except with Harry Potter. And then remember in Star Wars, when everyone is shooting red and green bursts of light at each other, and you can't exactly tell what's going on? It's like that too, except with Harry Potter. There's something beautiful about the absurd overmuchness of Rowling's narrative imagination — she just wants to cram in every single significant archetype in the history of storytelling. It's awesome to behold.

Sunday, 6:03 p.m. Page 704. It's true: The late Snape was just a misunderstood good guy. And I was right: Harry has to die so that the world might live. This whole sequence is actually deeply moving, and pretty much worth all the prior slogging — Harry accepts his death, relishes his last moments of life, and, surrounded by the ghosts of his dead family and friends, marches off to his death. When he asks his mother to stay close to him, I almost shed an actual tear. (Probably because it makes me think of my family, to whom I've been dead for a couple of days now.) Suddenly this is a legitimate tragedy. I'm impressed.

Sunday, 6:38 p.m. Page 738. And here's the cop-out. Harry Potter is actually Jesus Christ. It turns out that, because of the purity of his sacrifice, he doesn't actually have to die — he gets to go back and kill Voldemort. And just as a bonus, his sacrifice has redeemed humanity. As he tells Voldemort: "You won't be able to kill any of them ever again. Don't you get it? I was ready to die to stop you from hurting these people … I've done what my mother did. They're protected from you." Some would argue that the Bible is shorter and better.

Sunday, 6:55 p.m. Page 744. Harry and Voldemort circle each other like the knife fighters in "Beat It." Then Harry's wand-gush overpowers the Dark Lord's wand-gush: "Voldemort was dead, killed by his own rebounding curse, and Harry stood with two wands in his hand, staring down at his dead enemy's shell."

Sunday, 7:15 p.m. Page 759. After its brief flirtation with tragedy, the book ends with a disappointing (to me) epilogue full of har-har family-sitcom humor, in which the 36-year-old Harry and the gang, all blissfully intermarried, drop off the next generation of wizards at Platform 9 3/4. It ends with a really bland and terrible last sentence.

I close the book, forever, on Sunday evening at 7:22. —Sam Anderson

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#37 Bruce Wayne

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 04:03 PM

I'm with Luke on this one. I got swept up in the hype and became a fan of the series, but I wouldn't put Rowling up there with Truman Capote and George Orwell just yet.

She's more on par with Stephen King. She knows how to tell a great story. Nothing more, nothing less. Sometimes (most of the time) that's all that's required.

Well, anyone has one great story in them, and in the case Capote and Orwell ( a personal favorite) hundreds of them.

However, JK did something that neither author mentioned was ever able to accomplish. She introduced the art of reading to millions of children throughout the world, something that must not be overlooked. How many adolescents were, through their love of the protagonist, inspired to write their own stories to share with their friends and families?

I am not trying to be hyperbolic here. I am trying to be as objective as possible, and the one thing I know is that this series will stand the test of time, and will in fact be considered as one of the all time great works.
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#38 Bruce Wayne

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 04:08 PM

Not for anything, but Ron did not "learn" parseltongue. He imitated the sound that Harry had made to open the Chamber five years beforehand.

BTW, I am not Russian, and yet I can say f-you after hearing it said aloud once.

By the way, saying it in Russian is a great way to burn off steam in the classroom.
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#39 metzol

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 04:11 PM

Well, anyone has one great story in them, and in the case Capote and Orwell ( a personal favorite) hundreds of them.

However, JK did something that neither author mentioned was ever able to accomplish. She introduced the art of reading to millions of children throughout the world, something that must not be overlooked. How many adolescents were, through their love of the protagonist, inspired to write their own stories to share with their friends and families?

I am not trying to be hyperbolic here. I am trying to be as objective as possible, and the one thing I know is that this series will stand the test of time, and will in fact be considered as one of the all time great works.

As an English teacher I don't overlook what the series accomplished in advancing literacy, but that to me that is separate from what great writing is. I think it's absolutely awesome that people are waiting on line for hours to buy a book. In this day and age! It's incredible, but that has more to do with marketing and hype than with Rowling's talents.
I'm sure N'Sync and The Backstreet Boys have inspired millions of kids to take dance (Addy?) and singing lessons but I don't consider their music to be that good.
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#40 metzol

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Posted 27 July 2007 - 04:14 PM

Not for anything, but Ron did not "learn" parseltongue. He imitated the sound that Harry had made to open the Chamber five years beforehand.

BTW, I am not Russian, and yet I can say f-you after hearing it said aloud once.

By the way, saying it in Russian is a great way to burn off steam in the classroom.

Allow me to copy from that diary I posted because it's exactly how I feel.

"You know, Parseltongue: the horrifying snake-language hitherto spoken exclusively by Harry and Voldemort and serpents —a talent so rare that Harry was ostracized when people found out about it. Ron says he just imitated the noises he heard Harry make. Now, excuse my righteous Potter-dork anger here, but this is absurd — if this were possible, dark wizards and mischievous Hogwarts students would have been faking it for centuries, raising all kinds of snake-related hell."
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